> Years ago, I saw a Reddit thread asking men, specifically “red pill” men, what they would do if they were able to switch bodies with a woman. Theoretically, this switch (at least according to the prompt) would involve being a straight, cisgender woman, so “touch my boobies, have loads of sexy lesbian sex and pretend I wasn’t in a woman’s body” wouldn’t work as an answer.
>
> Because these types of men frequently criticized women for “banging ten Chads in the club bathroom,” (how big do they think a club bathroom is? What about the attendant standing outside with the Bath and Body Works sprays?) I stupidly thought that their womanhood fantasies would be a bunch of virtue-signaling comments about getting married young to a stable provider twenty years older, having lots of kids, and avoiding college or a career. But shockingly, those talking points went out the window when faced with this hypothetical switcheroo. Most of the comments were about using sex, or sex appeal, to make lots of money (usually by tricking old guys or hapless losers), having lots of one-night stands, or just doing sex work. It struck me that the fantasies of these men directly mirrored the type of behavior they claimed was responsible for the downfall of society.
>
> Part of this contradiction is that not all manosphere men are red pillers (I hate that I know this.) Trads and red pillers are actually at odds. A true “enlightened” red piller is someone who is completely at peace with women’s “nature” to seek out sex with attractive men, and is stoically devoid of jealousy or bitterness. He isn’t mourning the downfall of a traditional world- he’s “enjoying the decline.” He isn’t perturbed by a woman banging ten Chads in the bathroom because he isn’t shattered by the realization that women are humans with sex drives, who are capable of all the same depravities of men, which by the way, is basically the whole “red pill” they’re taking (in a way, these guys are the real sex-positive liberal feminists.) Arguably, he’s one of the Chads, or if he doesn’t want to share, he’s seamlessly walking past the loud bathroom to find some other hottie who wants to bang him. In his lane, flourishing, moisturized.
>
> But I feel like most men who consume this type of content have not reached this point of enlightenment. Many are still pissed off, bitter or jealous and I think some of this content exists to keep them that way. So, a lot of these dudes see a woman sleeping around and still feel angry about it. It’s easy to see this anger and think it comes from a place of being mad that these women aren’t sleeping with them, and perhaps that’s a part of it. But I’m going to say something you might find a little surprising (or not, if you’re familiar with my content.) Without approving of the misogynistic framing, I can at least understand where they’re coming from, even if they’re being hateful jerks about it. They’re not jealous of the guys these women are banging, they’re jealous of the women.
I know what you’re thinking—these men don’t actually want to switch places with attractive young women. And in a literal sense, of course they don’t, because they identify as men, and are attracted to women, but I’m not talking so literally. Even speaking less literally, maybe they would actually hate living any life of constant sexual attention, no matter what they claim. After all, your average young aspiring red piller could probably get plenty of attention from gay men if he really wanted to, but he doesn’t want to, because he’s not gay. And perhaps to women, getting attention from unattractive men might as well be the equivalent of gay male attention to a straight man (I don’t know if I totally buy that argument, but it’s made often.) But at the end of the day, these are two groups who are just completely talking past each other, because neither of them are able to imagine what the other’s life is like.
>
> Now, I’m not a perfect 10 and I never have been, but I think it’s safe to say I’ve been a decently attractive 22-year-old woman. I wasn’t promiscuous, because I was in a relationship, but if I had wanted to sleep around, it would have been very easy for me to do that. I’ve never been a socially awkward young man, but I’ve talked to plenty of them for my research. I can’t overstate just how different the lives of attractive young women and awkward or unattractive young men are. What I’ve ultimately concluded is that a lot of the supposed “disgust” for promiscuous women is jealousy, because the snippets of the “hot young woman” lifestyle we see on social media present a gender-swapped version of what many young men wish they had: no responsibilities, lots of resources and privileges that they get just for being attractive, and most of all, a bottomless pit of sex.
>
> Another story about the Internet: not long ago, I saw a guy tweet about how being a hot 22-year-old woman must be like heaven. He was quickly shot down by multitudes of women of all ages, who told him he was dead wrong. In their words, being a young woman, even a hot young women, was hell. They hated the nonstop attention, they felt unsafe, they weren’t taken seriously by anyone, they were treated as sex objects, and they didn’t think there was any unique benefit to their situation that was worth the downside of the constant come-ons and underestimations. The thing I found striking about this exchange was that these responses probably didn’t change his mind. Without knowing the original guy who posted the theory, they probably proved him “right.” Because for a lot of men, receiving constant sexual attention—even if some of it is unwanted—is actually what they want, or at least what they think they want.
>
> I know what you’re thinking: they don’t really want this! What about the possibility for harassment or assault? Would they be flattered if their DMs were full of unsolicited vulva photos from uggos who started calling them slurs when they failed to respond? And look, I’m not saying these guys are correct. For all I know, if they managed to pull a Freaky Friday with a hot young woman, they might run screaming back into their bodies and happily accept a lack of sexual attention if the alternative is an onslaught of it. But they have no way of knowing either way, so they continue to watch the lives of attractive women (mostly through social media) and feel that these women are living a dream they could never imagine.
>
> Consider for example, the SNL sketch/song Welcome To Hell. The idea is that life is hell for young women because they’re constantly being harassed and objectified. And look, I get it—I’ve experienced sexual harassment at multiple workplaces. It’s bad! But this messaging is mostly preaching to the choir. Women who have experienced sexual harassment might relate to it, but it’s not going to convince anyone else that being a young woman is “hell.” And I know this sounds flippant, but being a hot 22-year-old woman was actually great in general. It’s easy to say that being attractive is “just as much a curse as it is a blessing” or whatever, but it’s really not, and this take is doubly not-compelling from someone who’s never been ugly.
>
> I’m not saying life in general is easier for women, but if your main priority in life is to have no-strings-attached sex without much effort, and you aren’t worried about safety, it’s incredibly easy to do this if you’re a woman. I’m sure there are exceptions, but even an older or average-looking woman could easily get on a dating app and find a reasonably attractive sexual partner in minutes. While people talk a lot about younger women preferring older men, the reality is that an older woman—even one who wasn’t a total knockout—could easily find an attractive young man for sex with minimal effort. The reason this doesn’t happen very often is because the women aren’t interested. But the amount of men looking for casual sex far outweighs women in the same boat, and men outnumber women on basically every casual sex app or platform. There’s a reason that women are often let into clubs for free, while men need to pay. I’m not saying any of this is good or whatever, it just…is.
>
> Of course, this is cold comfort to women, most of whom don’t find this arrangement appealing. Most women want relationships of some sort, and the playing field is much more balanced in this department. A woman cannot just open an app and immediately develop emotional chemistry with a man who is madly in love with her and wants to be a devoted father and husband. Even if a woman has perfectly reasonable standards, marriages do not instantly manifest the way one night stands do. When it comes to finding marriage or serious commitment, men and women both experience a lot of the same struggles. But no-strings-attached sex? Woman have the upper hand. And for men who aren’t getting any female attention, casual sex or otherwise, this upper hand is insanely enviable.
>
> It’s easy to say, “Oh, give me a break, you don’t get laid, boo hoo, women actually have to deal with sexual harassment, cry me a river.” And yeah, not getting laid isn’t an excuse to be a massive dick about it, but it also doesn’t need to be a contest where the only two options are “never getting any sexual attention” and “being constantly sexually harassed.”
alex2003super on
Saw this on Cartoons Hate Her and I couldn’t not share with the class. The first time some fresh perspective comes to the debate about lOnElY yOUng MEn
ʕ•̫͡•ʕ•̫͡•ʔ•̫͡•ʔ•̫͡•ʕ•̫͡•ʔ
PauLBern_ on
I think CHH gets it bang on again. This whole ‘attention differential’ is a natural consequence of the number of participants from each group.
GlaberTheFool on
The good thing about the article is that the author doesn’t attempt to create some false equivalency between both groups, as having different problems but to the same degree. My first impression is that the downside to all the sexual attention the author is trying to emphasize has more to do with our tendency to magnify the negative effects of things we take for granted e.g. complaining about the heat of the sun.
Still, I wonder if the author would welcome a world where single women received the same amount of attention as single men. I think not. Women would completely lose in that scenario. After all, the one situation the author mentions where both men and women struggle equally is in relationships, and we know women get the short straw in those.
WAGRAMWAGRAM on
I think that’s an overly online article that could simply be summed up as “Instagram expectations bad”, which is true.
Also if I had tits for a day I’d definitely play with them.
5 Comments
> Years ago, I saw a Reddit thread asking men, specifically “red pill” men, what they would do if they were able to switch bodies with a woman. Theoretically, this switch (at least according to the prompt) would involve being a straight, cisgender woman, so “touch my boobies, have loads of sexy lesbian sex and pretend I wasn’t in a woman’s body” wouldn’t work as an answer.
>
> Because these types of men frequently criticized women for “banging ten Chads in the club bathroom,” (how big do they think a club bathroom is? What about the attendant standing outside with the Bath and Body Works sprays?) I stupidly thought that their womanhood fantasies would be a bunch of virtue-signaling comments about getting married young to a stable provider twenty years older, having lots of kids, and avoiding college or a career. But shockingly, those talking points went out the window when faced with this hypothetical switcheroo. Most of the comments were about using sex, or sex appeal, to make lots of money (usually by tricking old guys or hapless losers), having lots of one-night stands, or just doing sex work. It struck me that the fantasies of these men directly mirrored the type of behavior they claimed was responsible for the downfall of society.
>
> Part of this contradiction is that not all manosphere men are red pillers (I hate that I know this.) Trads and red pillers are actually at odds. A true “enlightened” red piller is someone who is completely at peace with women’s “nature” to seek out sex with attractive men, and is stoically devoid of jealousy or bitterness. He isn’t mourning the downfall of a traditional world- he’s “enjoying the decline.” He isn’t perturbed by a woman banging ten Chads in the bathroom because he isn’t shattered by the realization that women are humans with sex drives, who are capable of all the same depravities of men, which by the way, is basically the whole “red pill” they’re taking (in a way, these guys are the real sex-positive liberal feminists.) Arguably, he’s one of the Chads, or if he doesn’t want to share, he’s seamlessly walking past the loud bathroom to find some other hottie who wants to bang him. In his lane, flourishing, moisturized.
>
> But I feel like most men who consume this type of content have not reached this point of enlightenment. Many are still pissed off, bitter or jealous and I think some of this content exists to keep them that way. So, a lot of these dudes see a woman sleeping around and still feel angry about it. It’s easy to see this anger and think it comes from a place of being mad that these women aren’t sleeping with them, and perhaps that’s a part of it. But I’m going to say something you might find a little surprising (or not, if you’re familiar with my content.) Without approving of the misogynistic framing, I can at least understand where they’re coming from, even if they’re being hateful jerks about it. They’re not jealous of the guys these women are banging, they’re jealous of the women.
I know what you’re thinking—these men don’t actually want to switch places with attractive young women. And in a literal sense, of course they don’t, because they identify as men, and are attracted to women, but I’m not talking so literally. Even speaking less literally, maybe they would actually hate living any life of constant sexual attention, no matter what they claim. After all, your average young aspiring red piller could probably get plenty of attention from gay men if he really wanted to, but he doesn’t want to, because he’s not gay. And perhaps to women, getting attention from unattractive men might as well be the equivalent of gay male attention to a straight man (I don’t know if I totally buy that argument, but it’s made often.) But at the end of the day, these are two groups who are just completely talking past each other, because neither of them are able to imagine what the other’s life is like.
>
> Now, I’m not a perfect 10 and I never have been, but I think it’s safe to say I’ve been a decently attractive 22-year-old woman. I wasn’t promiscuous, because I was in a relationship, but if I had wanted to sleep around, it would have been very easy for me to do that. I’ve never been a socially awkward young man, but I’ve talked to plenty of them for my research. I can’t overstate just how different the lives of attractive young women and awkward or unattractive young men are. What I’ve ultimately concluded is that a lot of the supposed “disgust” for promiscuous women is jealousy, because the snippets of the “hot young woman” lifestyle we see on social media present a gender-swapped version of what many young men wish they had: no responsibilities, lots of resources and privileges that they get just for being attractive, and most of all, a bottomless pit of sex.
>
> Another story about the Internet: not long ago, I saw a guy tweet about how being a hot 22-year-old woman must be like heaven. He was quickly shot down by multitudes of women of all ages, who told him he was dead wrong. In their words, being a young woman, even a hot young women, was hell. They hated the nonstop attention, they felt unsafe, they weren’t taken seriously by anyone, they were treated as sex objects, and they didn’t think there was any unique benefit to their situation that was worth the downside of the constant come-ons and underestimations. The thing I found striking about this exchange was that these responses probably didn’t change his mind. Without knowing the original guy who posted the theory, they probably proved him “right.” Because for a lot of men, receiving constant sexual attention—even if some of it is unwanted—is actually what they want, or at least what they think they want.
>
> I know what you’re thinking: they don’t really want this! What about the possibility for harassment or assault? Would they be flattered if their DMs were full of unsolicited vulva photos from uggos who started calling them slurs when they failed to respond? And look, I’m not saying these guys are correct. For all I know, if they managed to pull a Freaky Friday with a hot young woman, they might run screaming back into their bodies and happily accept a lack of sexual attention if the alternative is an onslaught of it. But they have no way of knowing either way, so they continue to watch the lives of attractive women (mostly through social media) and feel that these women are living a dream they could never imagine.
>
> Consider for example, the SNL sketch/song Welcome To Hell. The idea is that life is hell for young women because they’re constantly being harassed and objectified. And look, I get it—I’ve experienced sexual harassment at multiple workplaces. It’s bad! But this messaging is mostly preaching to the choir. Women who have experienced sexual harassment might relate to it, but it’s not going to convince anyone else that being a young woman is “hell.” And I know this sounds flippant, but being a hot 22-year-old woman was actually great in general. It’s easy to say that being attractive is “just as much a curse as it is a blessing” or whatever, but it’s really not, and this take is doubly not-compelling from someone who’s never been ugly.
>
> I’m not saying life in general is easier for women, but if your main priority in life is to have no-strings-attached sex without much effort, and you aren’t worried about safety, it’s incredibly easy to do this if you’re a woman. I’m sure there are exceptions, but even an older or average-looking woman could easily get on a dating app and find a reasonably attractive sexual partner in minutes. While people talk a lot about younger women preferring older men, the reality is that an older woman—even one who wasn’t a total knockout—could easily find an attractive young man for sex with minimal effort. The reason this doesn’t happen very often is because the women aren’t interested. But the amount of men looking for casual sex far outweighs women in the same boat, and men outnumber women on basically every casual sex app or platform. There’s a reason that women are often let into clubs for free, while men need to pay. I’m not saying any of this is good or whatever, it just…is.
>
> Of course, this is cold comfort to women, most of whom don’t find this arrangement appealing. Most women want relationships of some sort, and the playing field is much more balanced in this department. A woman cannot just open an app and immediately develop emotional chemistry with a man who is madly in love with her and wants to be a devoted father and husband. Even if a woman has perfectly reasonable standards, marriages do not instantly manifest the way one night stands do. When it comes to finding marriage or serious commitment, men and women both experience a lot of the same struggles. But no-strings-attached sex? Woman have the upper hand. And for men who aren’t getting any female attention, casual sex or otherwise, this upper hand is insanely enviable.
>
> It’s easy to say, “Oh, give me a break, you don’t get laid, boo hoo, women actually have to deal with sexual harassment, cry me a river.” And yeah, not getting laid isn’t an excuse to be a massive dick about it, but it also doesn’t need to be a contest where the only two options are “never getting any sexual attention” and “being constantly sexually harassed.”
Saw this on Cartoons Hate Her and I couldn’t not share with the class. The first time some fresh perspective comes to the debate about lOnElY yOUng MEn
ʕ•̫͡•ʕ•̫͡•ʔ•̫͡•ʔ•̫͡•ʕ•̫͡•ʔ
I think CHH gets it bang on again. This whole ‘attention differential’ is a natural consequence of the number of participants from each group.
The good thing about the article is that the author doesn’t attempt to create some false equivalency between both groups, as having different problems but to the same degree. My first impression is that the downside to all the sexual attention the author is trying to emphasize has more to do with our tendency to magnify the negative effects of things we take for granted e.g. complaining about the heat of the sun.
Still, I wonder if the author would welcome a world where single women received the same amount of attention as single men. I think not. Women would completely lose in that scenario. After all, the one situation the author mentions where both men and women struggle equally is in relationships, and we know women get the short straw in those.
I think that’s an overly online article that could simply be summed up as “Instagram expectations bad”, which is true.
Also if I had tits for a day I’d definitely play with them.