The US House just approved a bill to enact year-round Daylight Saving Time. Clocks stay forward an hour permanently, which means more evening light, but later sunrises in winter. It also lets states opt out if they choose.
This is relevant to the sub because many people here agree that biannual clock changes are bad: not only is switching economically expensive, but it causes spikes in car crashes and other accidents. However, people here disagree on whether to adopt permanent Standard Time (more morning sunlight, less evening sunlight) or permanent Daylight Saving Time (less morning sunlight, more evening sunlight).
The case for permanent DST is that you get more daylight after work in the winter. Business groups especially like this because they think people shop and eat out more if it’s still light in the evening.
A common argument against permanent DST is that this pushes winter sunrise back to 9 a.m. in some areas. People often say that this is bad for farmers who have to get up early, which is yet another example of how the US coddles farmers like they’re an oppressed minority. People also say that a later sunrise is bad for kids who will have walk to school in the dark, though as one user in another thread jokes, “This is no longer a concern, because we have created a car-dependent society where walking to school even in bright light is extremely unsafe.”
Jokes aside, a better argument against permanent DST is health. Sleep researchers have argued that morning light is the strongest cue for synchronizing the body’s circadian clock, but DST delays morning light exposure, increasing “social jet lag” during winter.
Interestingly, permanent DST has been tried and rejected twice before. Nixon instituted it in 1974 and repealed it after public outcry after a year, while Russia tried it for three years starting in 2011 but then abandoned it for permanent ST.
My hot take is that many people who think they have a preference for permanent DST probably will end up having a revealed preference for permanent ST instead.
Simultaneity_ on
Maximilianne on
Jesus Christ you are supposed to have permanent standard time 🤦♀️
Tetracropolis on
It’s inaccurate. Midday should be when the sun is highest in the sky. Very simple. If you want more time after work then change the work finishing time.
secondsbest on
Bad for kids who already have to sit at a bus stop before dawn to go to school too early so their parents can go to work too early. I’m not a usual “think of the kids” kinda person, but this will help those who don’t need it and harm the young with their development. Fuck DST
DrunkenAsparagus on
Various places try this (including the United States in the 1970s), and almost always go back after like a year, because most people hate it. I get it. I love having the sun be out late, but waking up before sunrise fucking sucks.
You can’t legislate how long the sun is up for. I feel like if we want to ease the transition for people, the easiest way to do that is to maybe make the transition over the course of two weeks, with 30 minute increments. Digital clocks are common enough now. Idk, maybe that would be worse, but we have tons of evidence that people hate permanent DST more than regular DST.
What_the_Pie on
We’re hitting all the 70s classics. Violent law enforcement, inflation of our own doing, crazy corruption, permanent daylight savings.
LagunaCid on
as someone in Washington State I hope this lands. Most of Canada already made DST permanent and it would be very confusing for everyone living close to the border if the US doesn’t follow suit.
8 Comments
Submission statement:
The US House just approved a bill to enact year-round Daylight Saving Time. Clocks stay forward an hour permanently, which means more evening light, but later sunrises in winter. It also lets states opt out if they choose.
This is relevant to the sub because many people here agree that biannual clock changes are bad: not only is switching economically expensive, but it causes spikes in car crashes and other accidents. However, people here disagree on whether to adopt permanent Standard Time (more morning sunlight, less evening sunlight) or permanent Daylight Saving Time (less morning sunlight, more evening sunlight).
The case for permanent DST is that you get more daylight after work in the winter. Business groups especially like this because they think people shop and eat out more if it’s still light in the evening.
A common argument against permanent DST is that this pushes winter sunrise back to 9 a.m. in some areas. People often say that this is bad for farmers who have to get up early, which is yet another example of how the US coddles farmers like they’re an oppressed minority. People also say that a later sunrise is bad for kids who will have walk to school in the dark, though as one user in another thread jokes, “This is no longer a concern, because we have created a car-dependent society where walking to school even in bright light is extremely unsafe.”
Jokes aside, a better argument against permanent DST is health. Sleep researchers have argued that morning light is the strongest cue for synchronizing the body’s circadian clock, but DST delays morning light exposure, increasing “social jet lag” during winter.
Interestingly, permanent DST has been tried and rejected twice before. Nixon instituted it in 1974 and repealed it after public outcry after a year, while Russia tried it for three years starting in 2011 but then abandoned it for permanent ST.
My hot take is that many people who think they have a preference for permanent DST probably will end up having a revealed preference for permanent ST instead.
Jesus Christ you are supposed to have permanent standard time 🤦♀️
It’s inaccurate. Midday should be when the sun is highest in the sky. Very simple. If you want more time after work then change the work finishing time.
Bad for kids who already have to sit at a bus stop before dawn to go to school too early so their parents can go to work too early. I’m not a usual “think of the kids” kinda person, but this will help those who don’t need it and harm the young with their development. Fuck DST
Various places try this (including the United States in the 1970s), and almost always go back after like a year, because most people hate it. I get it. I love having the sun be out late, but waking up before sunrise fucking sucks.
You can’t legislate how long the sun is up for. I feel like if we want to ease the transition for people, the easiest way to do that is to maybe make the transition over the course of two weeks, with 30 minute increments. Digital clocks are common enough now. Idk, maybe that would be worse, but we have tons of evidence that people hate permanent DST more than regular DST.
We’re hitting all the 70s classics. Violent law enforcement, inflation of our own doing, crazy corruption, permanent daylight savings.
as someone in Washington State I hope this lands. Most of Canada already made DST permanent and it would be very confusing for everyone living close to the border if the US doesn’t follow suit.